Crosswind performance is way, way off guys.
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Final thought on this subject before I leave the forums here permanently as I have deleted the Blacksquare Turbine Duke from my computer and have no intention whatsoever of using it again.
The Developer here probably initially had good intentions but over-relied on Asobo's own hype in regard to progress with flight dynamics. One has to bear in mind that the MSFS2020 platform is primarily a scenery simulator, not a flight simulator, and that Aboso will NEVER properly grasp real world aircraft flight characteristics. Microsoft caters to the gamer crowd because that's where the money is; the gamer crowd could ultimately care less about flight dynamics as long as they can land someplace without crashing. Win/win for everybody here.
Asobo's vaunted ground friction variables with SU15 simply do not work as advertised and of course they never will. The supposed new aileron action required for proper lateral tracking in a crosswind situation is the stuff of an arcade game with little in common with real-world flight behavior. Blacksquare embraced Asobo's B.S. here and promotes it as a fix for all the flawed flight behavior in previous SU releases, knowing full well that this wasn't a fix for anything but rather a way to try and sugar coat bad flight dynamics more than anything else. Blacksquare, like Asobo, are ultimately about profit mongering and overhype rather than actual quality and realism.
ALL Blacksquare products have flawed flight dynamics, irregardless of over-hyped claims that are promoted about their products. Blacksquare knew the flight dynamics were broken with the SU14 release of MSFS, and tried to claim everything would magically be fixed with the SU15 release, knowing full well that this wasn't the case. Otherwise, one can't hype a product being perfect and garner initial sales volume.
I now have zero respect for the Blacksquare developer at this stage, despite his obvious technical talent (which I justifiably lauded in this thread), but some individuals demand far less respect than money. Sad. At least now I have more hard drive space.
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@Ballinger-France While I am very saddened to hear about your experience, and wish you luck finding only the best flight simulation addons in the future; however, I cannot let this message stand without a brief rebuttal, as I find your characterization of me greatly offensive.
I have dedicated my life to these addons over the last few years, spending around 16 hours per day working on them, because I care so much about preserving recent aviation history, and giving tomorrow's pilots the tools to learn. Around half of each day is spent responding to my users, implementing custom code solutions for their specific needs, and fixing unnoticeable bugs in aircraft released two years ago, just because I enjoy it. I am currently updating my TBM 850 with all the new technology I created for the Dukes as a free upgrade, and have already done so for the Baron, Bonanza, and new WT avionics in the Velocity. To suggest that I am profit motivated is an insult to the thousands of hours that go into creating each of my aircraft, often with weeks spent focusing on minute details, just because I know it will make someone smile.
As for the aerodynamics, all I can claim is that I have tried to do my best, included several fellow real world pilots in the process, and refer to respected members of the flight simulator community before every release and update for improvements. If, by your own admittance, Asobo's aerodynamics are less than satisfactory, then I find little use in attacking the aircraft designers who do our best with what the simulator can offer.
Please let me know if there is anything else, within reason, that I can do to otherwise improve your experience with my aircraft, and I will do my best to make it happen, as I am always happy to do for those who enjoy my work.
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@Black-Square - trust that the vast majority of us are 100% thrilled with the quality of your work, as well as your dedication to continually improving upon it. There’s always somebody like this, and from their first post I could unfortunately tell which direction this thread was going to go. I’m sorry you had to deal with it - I suppose it comes with the job, though. Once, many years back, I had to spend two hours listening to a guy on the phone threatening my company over a trivial and rare bug in our award-winning software, saying he was going to “go to the media and expose us” and so on. That’s the less fun part of software development.
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I don't understand the tirade. The claim that the A2A Comanche is a "gold standard" seems far-fetched. I like the A2A Comanche, but it can become an amusement park ride pretty fast in windy conditions during takeoff. I haven't tried it since they updated for SU15, so maybe it's better.
The fact is, no simulator is excellent at capturing flight dynamics, even million dollar Level-D sims. You work with what you have, and accept the flaws. I see people complain they can't keep the Fenix A320 on centerline, but I've never had an issue, even in high winds. It's important to put some perspective on things regarding individual hardware. For years I used the CH Yoke in FS2002, FS9, and FSX. I became adapted to the twitchy nature that I believed to be the sim, applying the FSUIPC curves and such. Then I decided I wanted the new Thrustmaster Boeing Yoke. It looked better and the CH was having issues. I was still using FSX Steam, as I didn't have money to upgrade to a new computer. To my shock, the A2A Bonanza, Comanche, Majestic Q400, and other add-ons were actually controllable. There was a heavy translation to the movement and I could bank aircraft without diving 2000 feet a minute. Needless to say, that TM Yoke has an entirely different feel to it than the CH Yoke. So people who complain about flight dynamics are often using hardware that frankly sucks in my opinion. The other half of that is spending time tweaking curves in the sim to dampen the twitchiness that is unfortunately part of the sim, regardless. I can take off in a rather strong crosswind in the Duke and not roll all over the place now. It is subtle, but I am personally not experiencing an uncontrollable roll which seems to be the complaint here. I have flown the Duke almost exclusively since its release, and have no problems with flight dynamics.
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@Ballinger-France I got second hand embarrassment from reading this.
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At least 20 people are on the side of reason based on the post reactions, might be a new record!
For anybody to give such a strong opinion on the handling and expect something to come of it, but provide little detail besides opinion and 'credentials' is laughable indeed. Any testing or comparison has to be done under controlled environments so others can replicate it and give feedback. That means using:
- consistent, fixed wind speeds & directions (not real-life weather, which will gust and fluctuate during the take-off run, especially if trees are in the area)
- published control curves & deadzones
- preferably identical hardware - or at least with similar travel limits
Without any of those specifics being posted here with respect to the setups in use, everything is just hearsay, opinion, expectations and 'feel'. There's nothing scientific in the discussions, so comparing experiences and perceived faults is relatively meaningless.
Compared to FSX, MSFS feels light years ahead with ground dynamics. It receives a lot of criticism in this area and of course it's not perfect, but aircraft actually feel like they are starting to flying before they leave the ground; something I never felt in FSX. I don't recall any small GA aircraft in FSX picking up a wing on the ground roll during crosswind take-offs (if not countered), not even the A2A range, but in MSFS it happens all the time with all kinds of aircraft.
There are many of us that are very appreciative of all the work done, who can enjoy what we have even if it's not perfect in every single way.
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I did some flight tests in cross wind with the turbine duke the 414 Cessna the c510 mustang and the Comanche airport was YMLT runway was 32L wind was set to 49 degrees speed set to 22.4 knots gusting wind was I think set to 22.69 wind was custom from ground to 10,000ft same wind speed and direction controls thrust master hotas and thrust master TRP rudder pedals all set to neutral just toe brakes set to + 19 sim set to realistic . With that I was able to fly all the planes and land them mostly on the centerline and all performed well all planes got pushed with the wind in the circuit but I was able to correct them with rudder input. Last weekend we had some nasty weather in Melbourne and Tasmania flying the duke in my normal flight from ymmb to ysth the sim produced some wild weather and we had some really wild crosswind at st Helen’s (ysth) landing was so much fun even though I had to fight it to the ground . Smiles . All up black square did amazing job with both the dukes and tbm . As for the gold standard of the A2A Comanche that plane always has the upper hand but not so much because of the flight model I put the dukes level with it , it’s the walk around and persistence that’s the things I love about the Comanche. But for my sim missions it’s only really a VFR sunny day plane for me the turbine duke is my go to for most of my flying . Smiles
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me thinks this "ballenger france from texas" is a troll bot.
