Pitch "jerks"
-
I like the Arrows very much, but when it is turbulent I notice the pitch movements are somewhat... jerky? For me it brakes the immersion a little bit, esp. on landings. Shaking because of turbulence is normal of course, but , how to describe.... as if it not goes like
0-0.1-0.2-0.3-0.4 etc to 1 but instead 0 - 0.5 - to 1@rene-feijen have the same, movements like pigeon head movement. Maybe some devs could comment on when and if they plan to fix this.
-
@rene-feijen have the same, movements like pigeon head movement. Maybe some devs could comment on when and if they plan to fix this.
@sebastianr said in Pitch "jerks":
@rene-feijen have the same, movements like pigeon head movement. Maybe some devs could comment on when and if they plan to fix this.
That's a good way do describe the problem!
-
I was going to make a post on this very topic, you beat me to it.
I find this jerkiness worse on finals below about 500 ft AGL to the point landing is generally a big disappointment to an otherwise great flight.
I did a test yesterday at my home airfield EGLK doing circuits with live weather using the default Bonanza, C172 and C152. The simulated turbulence on approach was very, in my view realistic and represented a one metric tonne aircraft flying through fluid air. The JF Arrow III on the other hand was as you describe very jerky and not very well simulated regarding turbulence.
-
I actually haven't been able to find out exactly what the cause of this is - I have my suspicions, but basically the Arrow handles differently to the default aircraft, that general behaviour seems to have been well received ("it feels heavier" and "it isn't like flying a kite" are a couple of representative comments that have been made) and I am wary of significantly altering that to fix something that does not affect all aspects of a flight.
At the moment, I am not sure if this is something that is 'fixable', it will continue to be looked at whenever I work on the PA28 series but for the foreseeable future it's something that will likely to remain as an unfortunate side-effect of how the aircraft generally handles.
-
I actually haven't been able to find out exactly what the cause of this is - I have my suspicions, but basically the Arrow handles differently to the default aircraft, that general behaviour seems to have been well received ("it feels heavier" and "it isn't like flying a kite" are a couple of representative comments that have been made) and I am wary of significantly altering that to fix something that does not affect all aspects of a flight.
At the moment, I am not sure if this is something that is 'fixable', it will continue to be looked at whenever I work on the PA28 series but for the foreseeable future it's something that will likely to remain as an unfortunate side-effect of how the aircraft generally handles.
@delta558 I think we are talking about this case near day 1 of release Arrow.
This is case talking before:
https://community.justflight.com/topic/2060/incorrect-behavior-during-gusts-of-wind/6?_=1630594367294Every time when use real weather, gust winds, not perfect CAVOK this how aircraft isn't what I know from IRL.
As you said this aircraft is heavy, in IRL wind gust don't provide jerkiness but easy oscillation in pitch.
It's urgent situation specially in approach and landing.
Devs please look deeply to it. Thanks
-
I actually haven't been able to find out exactly what the cause of this is - I have my suspicions, but basically the Arrow handles differently to the default aircraft, that general behaviour seems to have been well received ("it feels heavier" and "it isn't like flying a kite" are a couple of representative comments that have been made) and I am wary of significantly altering that to fix something that does not affect all aspects of a flight.
At the moment, I am not sure if this is something that is 'fixable', it will continue to be looked at whenever I work on the PA28 series but for the foreseeable future it's something that will likely to remain as an unfortunate side-effect of how the aircraft generally handles.
@delta558 said in Pitch "jerks":
("it feels heavier" and "it isn't like flying a kite" are a couple of representative comments that have been made) and I am wary of significantly altering that to fix something that does not affect all aspects of a flight.
If you read my post again, I totally disagree.
On final approach it does very much feel like a kite. During cruise its great, no complaints at all, but for some strange reason near the ground the turbulence simulation is completely wrong, and as described by the OP very Jerky and doesn't represent a one tonne aircraft flying through the air.
For reasons I don't understand (not being a programmer) the default GA aircraft have got it right, in this phase of flight.
-
@delta558 said in Pitch "jerks":
("it feels heavier" and "it isn't like flying a kite" are a couple of representative comments that have been made) and I am wary of significantly altering that to fix something that does not affect all aspects of a flight.
If you read my post again, I totally disagree.
On final approach it does very much feel like a kite. During cruise its great, no complaints at all, but for some strange reason near the ground the turbulence simulation is completely wrong, and as described by the OP very Jerky and doesn't represent a one tonne aircraft flying through the air.
For reasons I don't understand (not being a programmer) the default GA aircraft have got it right, in this phase of flight.
-
I appreciate your help and comments.
I find on approach this jerkiness occurs in varying amounts from about 500 ft AGL, this is way above the ground effect altitude, so no I don't believe ground effect is the cause. On my MSFS system its just the JF Arrow that suffers from this problem.
-
Well, I am sorry for you guys that you also experience this problem. But at least I don't feel alone in this matter, nor do I feel misjudging this matter.
Hope it will be solved sometime, for the rest the JF Arrows are really great planes!!
-
Well, I am sorry for you guys that you also experience this problem. But at least I don't feel alone in this matter, nor do I feel misjudging this matter.
Hope it will be solved sometime, for the rest the JF Arrows are really great planes!!
@rene-feijen Try this modification to the flight_model.cfg file...
[AIRPLANE_GEOMETRY]
htail_area =0 ;35.9 -
@rene-feijen Try this modification to the flight_model.cfg file...
[AIRPLANE_GEOMETRY]
htail_area =0 ;35.9@retiredman93231 said in Pitch "jerks":
@rene-feijen Try this modification to the flight_model.cfg file...
[AIRPLANE_GEOMETRY]
htail_area =0 ;35.9Thanks, will try!
-
@rene-feijen Try this modification to the flight_model.cfg file...
[AIRPLANE_GEOMETRY]
htail_area =0 ;35.9@retiredman93231 Is that only for the Turbo Arrow III?
-
@retiredman93231 Is that only for the Turbo Arrow III?
-
@rene-feijen it is worth a try for any of them that you experience the behaviour with. My concern is that it will have an adverse effect on handling elsewhere, as we have looked at that before, but your feedback will be useful.
@delta558 so just insert 0 space ; before the respective values ?
-
@delta558 so just insert 0 space ; before the respective values ?
I edited the config for the Turbow Arrow III. Flew in Stormy weather, it looks a bit smoother than before, but maybe placebo effect? Flew the same in the C172 and it was more fluent, while still shaking as much. It is more... dampened?
-
@retiredman93231 said in Pitch "jerks":
@rene-feijen Try this modification to the flight_model.cfg file...
[AIRPLANE_GEOMETRY]
htail_area =0 ;35.9Many thanks for your help with this problem.
I applied the mod but didn't notice any difference, I appreciate this might be just my system. I'm one of the lucky ones who never suffer from CTD's and have a very stable system regarding MSFS. Generally the JF Arrow flies great with the exception of this annoying jerky response simulating turbulence on approach.
I am willing to help the Dev's in any pre-realise testing to try and solve this frustrating problem.
-
I was just pointed to this one and i shall copy my text from my post here too.
What frustrates me a lot here is that i spend over a week watching reviews on YT, etc, and nowehere did i see this mentioned (until now). Not even when i asked for bugs.
Since i generaly fly between 1000-2000ft it simply makes the plane nearly unflyable as the FM just feels broken over uneven ground. I am also quite sure it has to do with updrafts/ downdrafts from the ground geometry.It is honestly so bad that if i could i would ask for a refund if this isn't fixable, despite how amazing the module is otherwise. This is simply just absolutely broken where i do 90% of my flying.
Here is my post:
Hey all.
I am having issues where the plane behaves very erratic during flight over steep cliffs/mountain sides and hitting the turbulent rising air.
It seems to really kick the nose of the plane up and down in a lightning fast manner. So fast it nearly looks like stutters (which it isn't).It this a known bug and will it be fixed? Over very mountainous areas it is nearly headace inducing when it jumps up and down a lot.
When over water or smooth/roling landscape it flies absolutely beautifull.
-
I edited the config for the Turbow Arrow III. Flew in Stormy weather, it looks a bit smoother than before, but maybe placebo effect? Flew the same in the C172 and it was more fluent, while still shaking as much. It is more... dampened?
@rene-feijen I don't think it is the turbulence in the air/wind, but the turbulence that comes from ground geometry.
-
I was just pointed to this one and i shall copy my text from my post here too.
What frustrates me a lot here is that i spend over a week watching reviews on YT, etc, and nowehere did i see this mentioned (until now). Not even when i asked for bugs.
Since i generaly fly between 1000-2000ft it simply makes the plane nearly unflyable as the FM just feels broken over uneven ground. I am also quite sure it has to do with updrafts/ downdrafts from the ground geometry.It is honestly so bad that if i could i would ask for a refund if this isn't fixable, despite how amazing the module is otherwise. This is simply just absolutely broken where i do 90% of my flying.
Here is my post:
Hey all.
I am having issues where the plane behaves very erratic during flight over steep cliffs/mountain sides and hitting the turbulent rising air.
It seems to really kick the nose of the plane up and down in a lightning fast manner. So fast it nearly looks like stutters (which it isn't).It this a known bug and will it be fixed? Over very mountainous areas it is nearly headace inducing when it jumps up and down a lot.
When over water or smooth/roling landscape it flies absolutely beautifull.
@cgnoorloos Did you try the mod recommended above...?
-
@cgnoorloos Did you try the mod recommended above...?
@retiredman93231
I did not, since i use GAJ52 did not notice a difference. And i am curious as to what else changes when that is added?
I can try it tonight to see if it helps.
