NAV mode keeps changing to ROL with Non-GPS Avionics
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Very interesting. I've not experienced the NAV->ROLL failover issue in the updated Caravan nor any of the other Black Square products, save for Starship (granted, I'm in Starship far more than any of the others). On the other hand, if others are experiencing the failover elsewhere, that tells me that it's likely unrelated to tweaks I've made to starship_interior.xml to "personalize" Starship a little more to my liking.
Now you've got me wondering if the underlying issue might be due to something in the VOR signal degradation realism code, which I believe is being rolled out to the Black Square fleet as each gets a 2024 update (could be wrong on that point though).
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Very interesting. I've not experienced the NAV->ROLL failover issue in the updated Caravan nor any of the other Black Square products, save for Starship (granted, I'm in Starship far more than any of the others). On the other hand, if others are experiencing the failover elsewhere, that tells me that it's likely unrelated to tweaks I've made to starship_interior.xml to "personalize" Starship a little more to my liking.
Now you've got me wondering if the underlying issue might be due to something in the VOR signal degradation realism code, which I believe is being rolled out to the Black Square fleet as each gets a 2024 update (could be wrong on that point though).
I just wanted to chime in here and say that we've discussed this a little on the forums in the past. I don't believe there is anything special about my aircraft that could induce this behavior, and there are no differences between my MSFS 2020 and 2024 versions in those regards, so I would encourage you to test both versions, and test with default aircraft, if you were willing to lend a hand.
@MarkS said in NAV mode keeps changing to ROL with Non-GPS Avionics:
Now you've got me wondering if the underlying issue might be due to something in the VOR signal degradation realism code, which I believe is being rolled out to the Black Square fleet as each gets a 2024 update (could be wrong on that point though).
All of my aircraft have had that feature for long before 2024, and there is nothing that could effect autopilot behavior in the signal degradation system.
If you're looking for the source of the issue, when you're using the KX155 + KX155 radio combination, there is nothing that stands between the MSFS native autopilot, and the MSFS native VOR navigation system.
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I just wanted to chime in here and say that we've discussed this a little on the forums in the past. I don't believe there is anything special about my aircraft that could induce this behavior, and there are no differences between my MSFS 2020 and 2024 versions in those regards, so I would encourage you to test both versions, and test with default aircraft, if you were willing to lend a hand.
@MarkS said in NAV mode keeps changing to ROL with Non-GPS Avionics:
Now you've got me wondering if the underlying issue might be due to something in the VOR signal degradation realism code, which I believe is being rolled out to the Black Square fleet as each gets a 2024 update (could be wrong on that point though).
All of my aircraft have had that feature for long before 2024, and there is nothing that could effect autopilot behavior in the signal degradation system.
If you're looking for the source of the issue, when you're using the KX155 + KX155 radio combination, there is nothing that stands between the MSFS native autopilot, and the MSFS native VOR navigation system.
@Black-Square thanks for clarifying. I withdraw my speculation. It's a puzzler though, isn't it?
ETA: just to help my understanding, wouldn't a failover occur if the signal degradation were so severe to cause a drop out, just as it does over the cone 'o' confusion?
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@Black-Square thanks for clarifying. I withdraw my speculation. It's a puzzler though, isn't it?
ETA: just to help my understanding, wouldn't a failover occur if the signal degradation were so severe to cause a drop out, just as it does over the cone 'o' confusion?
@MarkS Depends if everyone who is experiencing this is on MSFS 2024 or not. I can't say as I heard of this issue before MSFS 2024, but perhaps I'm mistaken.
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@MarkS Depends if everyone who is experiencing this is on MSFS 2024 or not. I can't say as I heard of this issue before MSFS 2024, but perhaps I'm mistaken.
@Black-Square I don't have 2020 anymore, else I'd be jumping into Starship 2020 to test this. Not going back though.
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I decided to try a VOR only trip in Alaska, with two KX 155Bs. Passenger version if it matters.
When in NAV mode tracking a VOR, the Autopilot keeps changing to ROL mode for no apparent reason. I change it back to NAV, it stays for maybe 20-40 seconds, then goes back to ROL. HDG mode persists.
This is with today's 1.1 update. I'd not tried flying old-skool on the initial version.
Can anyone else repro? Pilot error? I've never seen this on any BKSQ aircraft before. And never had this using TDI GTN units either
I can post a video to demo if that would be helpful.
@SteveKane Where in Alaska were you flying, and which VORs did this happen on? Could be due to altitude, and losing signal due to terrain? I tend to fly relatively low in a lot of Alaska, for the views, so I see similar behavior pretty often when terrain blocks a VOR signal.
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@SteveKane Where in Alaska were you flying, and which VORs did this happen on? Could be due to altitude, and losing signal due to terrain? I tend to fly relatively low in a lot of Alaska, for the views, so I see similar behavior pretty often when terrain blocks a VOR signal.
@RPGamerous It was from PAWG Wrangell to PAKT Ketchikan. VOR used was mainly Level Island 116.5. Cruise was at 7000 ft. However, It also reverted to ROL when I was on the ILS 11(?) approach into PAKT. Made it interesting with IFR conditions until 500' AGL, lol.
As mentioned above, also got similar behavior in the Duke, where it switched to HDG mode instead.
I tried monitoring some of the BKSQ VOR-Related LVARs in SPAD; I might dig into that a bit more to look for a pattern.
I briefly tried the same flight in the BaE 146, no cutouts, but that was late.
I'll try things again tonight.
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@RPGamerous It was from PAWG Wrangell to PAKT Ketchikan. VOR used was mainly Level Island 116.5. Cruise was at 7000 ft. However, It also reverted to ROL when I was on the ILS 11(?) approach into PAKT. Made it interesting with IFR conditions until 500' AGL, lol.
As mentioned above, also got similar behavior in the Duke, where it switched to HDG mode instead.
I tried monitoring some of the BKSQ VOR-Related LVARs in SPAD; I might dig into that a bit more to look for a pattern.
I briefly tried the same flight in the BaE 146, no cutouts, but that was late.
I'll try things again tonight.
@SteveKane Where on the ILS did it revert from? Were you on APCH mode then it reverted? Were you in HDG to intercept before it reverted (ie as you captured the localizer)? I'm wondering if the issue may be tracked down to which modes are active vs supposed to activate. I'm just curious.
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@RPGamerous It was from PAWG Wrangell to PAKT Ketchikan. VOR used was mainly Level Island 116.5. Cruise was at 7000 ft. However, It also reverted to ROL when I was on the ILS 11(?) approach into PAKT. Made it interesting with IFR conditions until 500' AGL, lol.
As mentioned above, also got similar behavior in the Duke, where it switched to HDG mode instead.
I tried monitoring some of the BKSQ VOR-Related LVARs in SPAD; I might dig into that a bit more to look for a pattern.
I briefly tried the same flight in the BaE 146, no cutouts, but that was late.
I'll try things again tonight.
@SteveKane Yeah then probably not related to altitude and terrain, I think between Wrangell and Ketchikan LVD should be easily tracked at 7000ft. I'll do some VOR flights of my own and see how it goes.
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@SteveKane Where on the ILS did it revert from? Were you on APCH mode then it reverted? Were you in HDG to intercept before it reverted (ie as you captured the localizer)? I'm wondering if the issue may be tracked down to which modes are active vs supposed to activate. I'm just curious.
@plicpriest1 said in NAV mode keeps changing to ROL with Non-GPS Avionics:
@SteveKane Where on the ILS did it revert from? Were you on APCH mode then it reverted? Were you in HDG to intercept before it reverted (ie as you captured the localizer)? I'm wondering if the issue may be tracked down to which modes are active vs supposed to activate. I'm just curious.
I don't quite remember, as I was more trying to focus on landing in IMC. I think I was in HDG mode angled towards the ILS, and I pushed APR. It captured, but soon switched to ROL mode.
I'll try to repro things later today.
